As we wrote a year ago:
In the words of a plugged-in tipster…“The empty lot where Flora Grubb used to be on Guerrero at 23rd is being excavated as we speak!” (Or type.)
Three lots which were first developed in 1895 to house the Stewart Memorial Presbyterian United Church which was cowardly firebombed in 1973 following its conversion to the Metropolitan Community Church with a predominantly gay congregation.
Next up for 1074 Guerrero, nine new homes in all: three two-unit residences along Guerrero, three single-family homes along Ames behind, and courtyards in-between.
Now dubbed “Nove,” prices for the nine units have been set at $1,125,000 to $1,749,000 (“about $750-$900/sqft, depending on the unit…the townhomes on Ames are less expensive”) and “the workmanship and quality of the finishes [are] seriously impressive” according to a plugged-in tipster who has walked through. Design by Handel Architects.
Only one of the nine units has officially been listed so far (and without much photography) while the development’s website isn’t yet offering up any interior or design porn.
∙ Flora Grubb On Guerrero (1074) Is Gone, Nine New Homes Up Next [SocketSite]
∙ Listing: 1062 Gurrero (3/2) – $1,575,000 [MLS]
∙ Nove [nove-sf.com]
Thanks for the update and history.
The building looks great from the outside.
The name seems pretentious- why must every new development have a silly name?
It would have been nice to incorporate one of its older names somehow. What’s a “nove” ?
incorporate one of its’ older names? huh? are you kidding?
sounds like an attempt to bring something, anything Victorian to a nice modern project. leave it alone.
“Nove” means “Nine” in Italian – perhaps a reference to nine units?
I wonder what the “nove” residents will think of “Sunday” median parking? Dolores and Guerrero both were parked solid yesterday until mid-afternoon.
I toured the three open units on Sunday, and if you like modern, you will love this project. It is not my personal style, but it is very well done with excellent quality materials.
With the city’s transit first policy, I don’t understand how the Sunday median parking on Guerrero and Dolores is allowed. Anybody know?
My take (walked through on Sunday)–
the interiors are much, much nicer than the out-of-place facade and loopy roofline (belongs in Miami if you ask me). the ipe facade-work looks like plastic. contrast the lovely reclaimed wood on the new mod condo building on 22d b/t valencia and bartlett.
staging is by limn–great stuff!
the units are well suited to exhibitionists–very exposed to one another across the small central garden. the architect/developer should have designed-in some attractive, recessed blinds.
finish quality and workmanship is top notch, save for some imprecise stair-cuts in the wallboard (which can probably be caulked or otherwise filled for the intended “flush” effect)
the no-mouldings, everything-is-flush look is great for an art gallery, but seems impractical for a home. how long before the bases of the walls are dinged up by mops, brooms, vaccuum cleaners, etc.? ditto for the gorgeous but apparently unsealed oak(?) floors.
the townhomes on ames st. have a master BR on the top level and the other 2 bedrooms on the garden level–down 3 flights of stairs from the master. not at all practical for parents with young children.
the pricing seems rather aggressive. what other large, 3-4 BR condos (if any) in the mission/lower noe/mission-dolores area have sold for north of $750/sqft? (does anyone know what the new condos at 21st & church sold for? or the “view” units on upper cesar chavez that were brought to market maybe a year or 18 months ago?)
all in all, any buyer looking for “modern” in this area will find a much more distinctive and to my eye pleasing product two lots down ames st.–to wit, the cottage at 141 ames, which was featured on this site about 2 years ago. (but the ames cottage is a 1 BR, and doesn’t have parking)
“With the city’s transit first policy, I don’t understand how the Sunday median parking on Guerrero and Dolores is allowed. Anybody know?”
Transit First LOL!
sounds like an attempt to bring something, anything Victorian to a nice modern project. leave it alone
Are you capable of expressing yourself without being a total crank? It doesn’t really seem so. It’s just an opinion, guy. I like history is all. Just a little nod to the past in name only would have been sort of cool in my book.
The answer to the median parking thing is that it’s technically not allowed but the cops don’t care.
Also, regarding median parking, this isn’t a transit street (there are no buses on Dolores), so parking doesn’t really violate any “transit first” policies.
Transit First policies simply mean that transit should have priority in the city’s policies (and funding), not that everyone is forced to ride transit. I, for one, am not bothered by the temporary use of right of way for parking on Sundays. To me, it’s a reasonable use of space for a temporary event on a day when there is little commute traffic. However, I know lots of folks who grumble about it because the churches seem to be the only folks who get this sort of special deal. (as anonn notes, it’s not official but of the wink/nod variety)
LOL..of course it’s your opinion. mine too. I prefer looking to the future, not living in the past. Don’t take it so personal; it’s just a blog, dude.
he’s not your guy, friend!
Free, unpermitted, private use of public right of way. Not fair. Kids growing up near Guerrero and Dolores are being taught that free visitor parking is more important than their quality of life – even on non-commute days and times.
“…the no-mouldings, everything-is-flush look…”
Does anyone know how this flush look is accomplished? My impression is that door and window trim isn’t there as a decoration but rather to cover up the “slop” gap between the framing headers and the actual window/door frame.
Without trim, I’d think that the sheetrockers have to be ultra precise to get everything to line up just right. Also it seems like over time with enough door slams, a crack might begin to form where the sheetrock/mud/whatever meets the door frame. In a traditional trim installation, the slight movement/settling that would cause a crack is hidden beneath the trim.
If there’s some trick then I’d love to know.
Yeah Mission Mom. You might be on to something. I wonder if that contributes to all the non parallel parking Missionites who’ll sooner just double park every single time.
@ Mission Mom, have you discussed this with Supervisors Dufty and Campos?
He’s not your friend, bud
mission mom, just take responsibility for raising your own kids. Life isn’t fair, start with that lesson. Besides, what’s not fair, I’m sure your “children” dont’ even care about parking. Stop projecting your NIMBY ways on them and they may grow up to be better kids and not self-focused brats like yourself.
ouch! you go grumpy!
I tend to agree with you.
MoD,
You are right about the taped over door jamb detail. That will crack out over time. I don’t know what they did here, the pictures don’t show any door that I see. Window in these shots (and in general) are different. The sheetrock returns in with a corner bead so the joint is on the return side of the window in a hidden caulk joint. Flush base is done differently as well using sheetrock channel moldings. So, those joints are good. You can make a flush reveal spaced off of doors with similar moldings, where the jamb is covered by wood casing flushed to the rock. Not totally smooth as there is a control joint, but much better practically.
Previewed these in early February before they were finished, but was impressed:
http://insidesfre.com/2010/02/03/preview-noves-noemission-luxury-condos-taking-shape/
Very nice floorplans, very high end. Worth stopping in.
Went by to take a look at these units yesterday. Not as impressed as I thought I would be given the amount of hype, although not totally suprised since I’m not often impressed by Vanguard properties. Didn’t like the floorplans at all and tandem parking for a 1.5 million pad? You better be on good terms with your neighbor since there will need to be some negotiations getting into and out of your garage. The three townhomes in the back did have their own space which was nicer. Maybe I’m just not getting it, but I did not think the finshes were so “high-end”. Nice kitchen and bathrooms, but without molding, I thought the floor/wall interface just looked atrocious. Can you imagine trying to vacuum out those spaces. The cutting was so imprecise at the bottom of all the walls…my 2 year-old could do better. To me, it looked like they ran out of money at the end. Just my opinion, though. And I don’t think they’ll get asking on all the units, even though apparently one unit is already sold.
He’s not your bud, pal.
Harpo’s eyebrows (including the third eye).
WOW! Taking away not 1, but 2 sidewalks for driveways and garage doors, for one building. How incredibly Vacaville of you!
I spoke too soon, for we have 3 driveways/ garage door behemoths! What a dog of a building. Modern urban architecture FAIL!
@d.o.: This is classic nimbyism at its’ worst. So let me get this right. The EXISTING buildings adjacent to this project with garage doors and curb cuts are ok, huh? But any NEW buildings with garage doors and curb cuts (all legal) fail as modern urban architecture?
I got mine. But you don’t get yours.
cool.
Not one but two photos of the beautiful garage floors! Do love.
Sorry, I have nothing to add to the “modern vs traditional” or “cars versus carless” psychodramas because I’ve already taken my Thorazine.
* stares peacefully, unblinking *
@noearch: Whether it’s little things like curb cuts or big things like seismic strength, new developments are justifiably held to a higher standard than older buildings like the ones next door. You’re an architect and you obviously know this, which is why I find your comment @9:44 to be a little bit mystifying.
The developers were starting from a clean slate. Couldn’t they have found a better solution than excessive curb cuts?
@ noe arch
it’s just a blog dude! chill out girlfriend.
And my point was that it takes up 3 curb cuts. I could live with just one (but still cringe worthy) but 3.. for one building? Who do these clowns think they are? I hope the bank forecloses on the developer.
I’m with D.O. The developer obviously wanted to go the townhouse route for simplicity, but it would’ve been nice to have one curb cut and one garage door, with some sort of shared garage space. While it would have been a little more complicated in terms of connecting the garages to the units above, it would have paid dividends by providing at least two extra street parking spaces and additional landscaped space in front of the building. I think the trade off is worth it, and benefits the building/owners as well as the general public.
This is the kind of stuff that drives me crazy. I think the City should be much more proactive in pushing for these sorts of solutions. And I agree that noearch needs to take his medicine. He’s been a bit cranky lately.
^ I believe that there are 3 seperate lots thus 3 seperate bldgs, even though it looks like 1 complex.
The interesting Question is if the developer subdivided 1 lot to do this. If so, I question the value. New construction is always build as condos anyways, so selling a condo in a 2-3 unit lot vs selling one in 9 adds little value in this specific case. Especially since the project does look like 1 big bldg. They could always put double walls between units for better sound insulation on a single lot. It would Also be more expensive to build the project as seperate structures on subdivided lots than a single large lot.
So if that’s the case, the city (in theory DPW) could have looked ahead, given the intention of the project and kept it as a single lot. Then it would have been possible to make a single large garage space with only 1 door. But that’s a planning issue and planning does not determine lot splits- DPW does. As usual in SF gov, left hand doesn’t know what right hand is doing.
P.S. This reminds me of the project on 22nd st @ so van ness. So far 3 side by side bldgs, all new construction, all with seperate garages and curb cuts. But in that case the developer built one at a time. So perhaps the idea was finance/build 1, sell, collect proceeds and go on to next.
But I still think that in theory, it would have been simpler (and cheaper) to build 1 bldg on all the lots at once. What gives?
I’m never cranky here, but yes, I am critical at times. I enjoy commenting here on SS about different projects. Design criticism can only enhance the dialogue and perhaps provide feedback for future projects. Some projects are really great, some are not.
If you don’t like my comments, then don’t read them.
As for the 3 garage doors and curb cuts, well..that’s simply the result of the developer choosing to do separate townhouses. Yes, one could probably have done just one garage door with a common garage. Those require a LOT more turn around space and circulation, most likely resulting in fewer parking spaces. That’s the downside.
The current codes allow for separate garage doors and curb cuts. I’m sure that if the neighbors had not liked that solution they could have appealed to the Planning Commission to modify that.
What strikes me as very “nimbyesque” is that I hear no complaints about the existing separate garage doors and curb cuts all up and down Valencia St.
BTW, it would actually seem to me that parking could be more efficient, given that each of these garages serves two units (that’s correct, isn’t it?) I haven’t seen the layout, but I presume that each unit has independent access to their vehicle, wasting lots of circulation space. I’m guessing you could provide more efficient circulation for six vehicles with one entrance.
First home to over priced plant place, now home to over priced homes. Yay!
Viewed it. The lack of baseboard seams is egregious. Raw plywood visible underneath the island was offputting too. Looks like they were in a big rush to finish. Very cool floors tho, IMO. Liked the leathern wallpaper look too.
Thanks for all of your posts & comments. I’m one of the listing agents and am excited to sell such an interesting project.
Also, the website just went live and now has additional photos so feel free to check it out, http://www.nove-sf.com
Colleen, honey..
ah..don’t get yourself all worked up over the comments and criticisms..we’re not here to promote your projects. Educate yourself about what people expect from a new development..and learn how to answer question…things like square footage, materials, etc…
noearch….So condescending and snooty. Get over yourself!!
I toured these today during broker’s tour and I really wanted to like them. I personally love the location and imagined myself living in one happily…but not at that price.
Unfortunately, I think they are at least 20% over priced. One of the model units is $1.575M and for that price buyers have lots of options. I heard the most expensive home is in contract already (>$1.7M) and I wonder how it will appraise.
As much as I like them, I will tell my buyers to be wary of irrational exuberance here. It will be interesting to see if the rest of the market agrees.
Noearch, chill out! the listing agent is trying to help by providing more information. That is the point of a blog. I think this is a beautiful, well presented project. Yes, it is expensive but it is unique. When I was there on Sunday there were a lot of interested parties…none of which (as far as i could tell) were objecting to price or $/sq foot or lack of information about materials. NO NEED TO BE SO CONDESCENDING. take a chill pill.
If a nine unit building were built, at least one BMR unit would have been required, but I think that 3 unit buildings don’t require BMR. I think only buildings over 5 units require BMR units.
Based on the pictures on the web site that Colleen pointed us to (thanks!), I think the developer deserves all sorts of kudos for trying lots of different things with materials, finishing, the roof line, the massing, and use of the land — all non-standard, interesting, commendable, and quite well done, IMHO.
I find it classic Innernets that people are constantly slamming developers here for “standard contractor crap” (how many times have we heard about granite or whatever being “so 2007”). And yet, when we see someone trying to push the envelope in a way that doesn’t get all “Saitowitz” (cause gosh doesn’t everyone know HE’s off his ROCKER and NOBODY would EVER want to live in one of THOSE KOOKY KRAZY buildings) what do we hear?
Three curb cuts!!!
Tandem parking!!! THAT’LL NEVER WORK!!!
I can’t believe there’s no baseboard — OMFG NO BASEBOARD — WHERE’S MY ANGINA MEDICINE! EVERYONE KNOWS YOU HAVE TO HAVE BASEBOARD!!! SOMEONE CALL THE POLICE!!!!
Ya know, there just might be folks that appreciate living in someplace unique, and golly, if they’re really fond of baseboard, they can put in their own. Crazy, I know. But then again, I like Saitowitz too.
I’m sure the SS folks will update us with sale status, and then we’ll find out if the lack of baseboard and tandem parking causes a 20% haircut or not. I’m going on record as saying… um… not.
Hey Kurt,
After jumping off your high horse, why don’t you go take a look at these units in person. It’s not so much that there’s no baseboard (b/c I also appreciate clean lines), but rather the cut above the floor was so ragged. If you want to have that flush look and skip the baseboards/moulding then –OMFG–you better make sure you know how to cut it precisely. Otherwise, it looks cheap and poorly crafted. Looking at those messy floor lines all day (and vacuuming out hairballs, food crumbs, etc that got jammed between the floor and walls) would cause me to reach for my angina medication frequently.
Flush base is not the same as no base.
The last person I hired to vacuum out my hairballs from the baseboard was an unemployed realtor. Did a pretty good job until he started to stage my house without my approval.
There is another important reason developers often choose to do townhouses instead of larger condo projects. Every condo project eventually sues the developer for construction defects. Out of a dozen units, there is always one smarmy attorney trying to get something for nothing for himself and the other condo purchasers. It is so bad many architects refuse to design condos because they can’t get enough errors and omissions insurance to cover future lawsuits. The theory is, and it appears to be true, that there are far fewer lawsuits with townhouses just because you only have 2 or 3 parties in each homeowners association instead of a dozen in one homeowner’s association to get their panties all in a knot over defects, real or imagined.
Yay. Realtor bash number 6 million from the jockey-namesake architect. I was gonna say stick to architecture and skip the comedy, noearch. But after finally looking at the link you keep throwing up perhaps you should quit your day job too. Newsflash. People hiring architects want to see high quality photography on architects’ websites.
LOL. oh, ok.
Dan & Jim- you both raise good points. Thanks for your input!
Toadie, I do love my high horse, I admit. And I’ll risk climbing down to go peek at the units. I’ll bring the angina medicine just in case.
Good call annon- I looked at the website for noearch and the projects do not look like anything special, the pics are poor quality and it is a bad website all around. noearch never has anything positive to say. Maybe architects that live in poorly designed houses shouldn’t throw stones.
NEVER judge an architect’s work by a website. Did the architect make the choice for blue tile in the bathroom or the client? Would you judge whether or not to buy a house by a website? I recently asked someone from John Wheatman’s office why they do not have a website, and they answered, why would we?
I used to have a website myself of our office’s work, but took it down as I found the client’s attracted to our office and design style were not the type of people who could actually afford our services. The other problem is that many of our clients have asked to not have their homes broadcast in any form of media, including a home we design-built in Newport Beach that Architectural Digest magazine was very interested in featuring as a cover story.
Did anybody say anything about judging work? or judging a website and its photography? You keep throwing a link up, well guess what, you ask for it to be judged.
Finally went through this project. Beautifully conceived and beautifully executed. The quality of light throughout the units is excellent – with windows and doors extending almost to the ceiling. The top floors with the barrel vaulted ceilings are particularly wonderful, with light cascading across the ceilings and down the walls without shadows.
Actually I really don’t care at all what anonn (fluj the realtor) thinks about my website. My website isn’t that important for me in securing new clients. Most of my work is thru referrals and past results from happy clients.
Lots of clients really aren’t concerned if architects have a website or not. It’s a very small component in selecting an architect, anyway.
My site is simple, inexpensive and not at all flashy.It works for me, and that’s all that really matters.
As for my comments here, most would agree that I offer great positive and negative critical reviews. I am trained to see quality and trained to see poor workmanship. My goal is to help potential buyers look more critically at real estate, and ask the right questions, and ultimately negotiate the best price for themselves.
fluj is dead. But he really appreciated noearch’s helpful altruism while he was alive.
Wow. I think most readers would agree that Noearch has a slightly inflated sense of self. The unemployed architect I hired to clean the crumbs and hairballs out of my baseboards does too.
LOL..no, I’m just good at what I do..
btw: fluj is not dead…he still slithers around here a lot.:)
The development has a very clean, modern look to it. I find the color combination in the kitchen area to be very soothing. The large italian porcelain and glass tiles in the bathrooms are very well placed. New owners will enjoy for many years to come.
The sale of 1062 Guerrero closed escrow today with a reported contract price of $1,490,000 (5 percent under asking).
Just wanted to say that I appreciated that update on the sale price. I guess the buyers didn’t mind the lack of baseboard molding after all 😉
Don’t ask me why I’m reading old dead SS threads tho. I’d have to tell you I have no life.
The last one of these sold for $619 psft, an 18% decline from asking over ten months.
http://www.redfin.com/CA/San-Francisco/151-Ames-St-94110/home/26790982
“decline from asking”, really that’s what your going with on a new build.