CFAH

Bayview Map: Palou & Lane and 5800 Third Street

On Monday it was one reader’s reality versus perception regarding life around Sixth Street in mid-SoMa/Market/town. Today we highlight another reader’s reality, and this time it’s living off of Third Street in Bayview:

[L]ike many areas of San Francisco you have to be cautious and use common sense. I live on Palou Ave at Lane about a block from 3rd. I have lived there since July. Got a pretty decent deal on a 1200 square foot, 1925 2bedroom house in good shape with views, decent yard, original nice details. I did talk with a few neighbors before getting in. Many long-time owners, also new folks to the neighborhood. Young Latino families, Asian, and several 30 something white gay couples.

I feel reasonably safe, but I have heard gunshots. Only once. I used to live in the Mission and heard them more often. This development [5800 Third Street] and grocery will definitely help establish the neighborhood as a nice and “affordable” for many SF citizens. The grocery is especially needed.

The condo’s do have to be pretty nice and large to sell from the mid 500’s as I bought my house for $550,000 and there are currently many houses in the $500K to $600K range. I think most people will want a house as opposed to a condo in a 300+ unit condo complex.

Comments from Plugged-In Readers

  1. Posted by Jordan

    A good friend of mine lives a few blocks up the street from 3rd on Palou and, yes, it is nicer here than you might imagine.
    However, Third Street is something scary as soon as night falls. Also, think twice about living here if you like to roam around the neighborhood. There are some streets just a few blocks north and east that I wouldn’t be caught on day or night.
    My friend was excited to buy a house this year in a neighborhood that is improving. Still, he bought a shotgun for peace of mind when he moved in.

  2. Posted by Invented

    Southward investment is happening – 15 years forward — the area will be incredible. It has the weather, location, transit via the new light rail, and has lovely hilly topography with many wider residential streets. If you can wait.
    Since time generally stands still here,, check back in 15/20 years. In the meanwhile, sip Ritual Coffee @ Flora Grubb just off 3rd to be transported.
    Gunshots? Murder? I hear gunshots every couple of months in Alamo Sq. Historic District – numerous murders in the 3 years I’ve been here.
    In our anything-goes, live-and-let-live, look-the-other-way-administered city –that’s one thing which is unlikely to change.

    • Posted by Swanson deibroglio

      7 years on and people still getting shot at 3rd and Palou…

      • Posted by SFrentier

        And also getting shot in the mission….all the while paying $1400 per square foot for new, hip condos, which are in high demand. And even in Noe and Pac Heights there are robberies and theft on a regular basis.

        If you’re not ok with city living in gentrifying neighborhoods, than I suggest that you consider a town like Los Gatos.

        • Posted by atila unchained

          I’m ok with living in gentrifying neighborhoods, just not dangerous non-gentrifying neighborhoods like Bayview.

          • Posted by SFrentier

            So mission is ok 4u?

          • Posted by anon

            Mission crime has always been a gang story. The gang thing probably even suppresses random street crime. Bayview’s more an in your face crime area.

            10,000 housing units in the Bayview. How many have turned over since 2007 ??

          • Posted by SFrentier

            Look dudes, in spite of your attitudes, BV is gentrifying. It’s clear from all the new people buying there. Who cares how many homes turned over since 2007. Whatever the number is, is what it is. It’s actually good that there is a higher percent of homeowners in BV than most parts of SF. Homeowners usually aren’t criminals and they have more control over their homes, and won’t flood the market at the next downturn. So I see it as a benefit. You’re either blind or ignorant if you think BV is not gentrifying.

            Don’t like it, don’t f-ing live there. There are plenty of others that will.

          • Posted by SFrentier

            Oh, and what anon says about gang violence and “street” violence makes zero sense. Hint: gang violence and street violence go hand in hand. And, both the mish and BV have gang problems, as well as street crime. And, most even semi- central SF neighborhoods have street violence. This is a city.

          • Posted by rearview

            Look rudes, despite your certitudes, BV is terrifying. It’s clear from all the experienced people leaving there. Who cares how many crime cases opened since 2007. Whatever the number is, is what it is. It’s actually good that there is a higher rate of crime in BV than most parts of SF. Criminals usually have more control over their hoods, and won’t flood the jail at the next beatdown. So I see it as a benefit. You’re either blotto or inglorious if you think BV is not terrifying.

            Don’t like it, don’t f-ing die there. There are plenty of others that will.

          • Posted by anon

            Your last “buying $700k condos left and right” turned out to be just five condo’s in 6 months. 10 per year out of 10,000 is 0.1% per year of turnover. And maybe not all turnover, some is probably new construction. And just like folks said on this thread 7 years ago, it’s not getting the new people in it’s getting the bad element out that matters.

          • Posted by SFrentier

            Don’t worry clown, there are hundreds of homes that have sold in BV over the last 7 years, and dozens and dozens for over $6-700k. Face it, the neighborhood is gentrifying. The worse housing projects are getting remade into mixed income housing. Hunters point is a massive new project. So is candlestick. How can you be so dense and not see all this as gentrification? You probably rent anyways.

          • Posted by anon

            “and dozens and dozens for over $6-700k.”
            So sub 1% over seven years? Yup…

          • Posted by SFrentier

            You really are very thick. What’s wrong with $700k? Not enough for you?

            Besides, most of the problem people live in the projects, and those are getting torn down, redone as mixed income and will be managed differently. 2 projects in the mission were redone that way (didn’t even incl. the mixed income component)- Cesar Chavez and Valencia gardens- and they are much better than before, even years later.
            You really need to get yourself an education.

          • Posted by pulsetaker

            The city promises the moon, but the reality is that the troublemakers have to live somewhere. And the city shows no will to jail for less then serious violent felonies. So the crazy street druggies get corralled in the tenderloin and public housing troublemakers in the Bayview.
            It would make sense to house these people in a cheaper part of the state with plenty of land, but politically that’s just never going to happen.

          • Posted by SFrentier

            Pulsetaker- actually it is happening. Richmond and Antioch are the new dumping grounds. Those BV projects are all getting redone in the next several years. It’ll be a different story there altogether. That’s what happened with the mission projects on Cesar Chavez and Valencia gardens. They’re not perfect, but 5-10 years later, they are a dramatic improvement over what was there before. And I say that from first hand experience. There privately managed and much more stringent on troublemakers. Most of the people living there are fine, just poor folks that need some assistance.

  3. Posted by redseca2

    The only problem is that I spent a lot of time out here in the early ’80’s and it was an “up and coming” neighborhood back then as well.
    There was a huge warehouse complex at the end of Revere back then that was divided up into ad-hoc units for artists. Friends had a 10,000 SF loft floor at .07 a square foot, as in 10,000 square feet for $700 a month!
    History Trivia: The warehouses had formerly been a leather tannery that manufactured the patches on Levi jeans, until someone told them they couldn’t dump all that tannery effluent into the bay.

  4. Posted by curmudgeon

    Redseca2..I think I know the complex you’re talking about. Had a friend who lived there in the 90’s. It it’s the one I’m thinking about, everyone was unfortunately kicked out of it. Some deluded tenant decided to protest a rent increase, on the theory that the tenants should be protected by rent control. Since it was industrial space not permitted for residential use, that only succeeded in bringing the city inspectors down on the owner and all the live/work tenants got booted.

  5. Posted by Stephanie

    Comment to post by Invented:
    Instead of 15 years out, you better add another 50 years or more before this area ever gets any better. Especially at the level of walking around at night and patronizing any restaurants or stores nearby.
    My friend is a SF police officer and he patrols the Bayview/Hunter’s Point area and he hears gunshots everyday.
    Remember, it’s the PEOPLE that make the difference, NOT the new buildings, condos, stores, restaurants, etc. I don’t care how many new projects they build, it will only get better if people change.
    50,000 49ers football fans leave on gameday and I can tell you that hardly anyone patronizes any restaurants on 3rd st.
    This area is the SAME as it was in the 70’s, that’s over 35 years and counting.

  6. Posted by bayview heights guy

    Response to Bayview comments:
    I live in Bayview Heights-the area from Jamestown (street Monster Park is on) up the hill. Definitely the most underrated location in the Bayview. I have a 100 yr old craftsman bungalow in mint condition on 2 lots with views and a huge garage, driveway, and rental unit in the back (earthquake shack we renovated).
    Mostly older families here, but a big mix of black, latino, and asians. For some weird reason, a lot of the weirdos don’t wander this far up Third street and it is pretty quiet. No burglar bars on my window….ever. We inherited the house, so it has been in the same hands for 60 years and never had any problems with crime.
    Bayview Heights is not close to a good grocery store (Foodsco is closest) and the closest restaurants are on San Bruno, across the freeway. Definitely not the most ideal neighborhood, but on Jamestown, all kinds of condo construction is going on, so maybe some amenities will follow.

  7. Posted by Stan

    San Francisco just hit the 100 mark for murders this year, a 10 year high. The majority of them are in the Mission, Bayview/Hunter’s Point & Fillmore areas.
    In addition, violent crime, robberies and car theft continue to plague these areas also at a 10 year high.
    Do you really want to subject yourself and your family to this much amount of crime. My #1 rule of thumb that has served me well, don’t be at the wrong place at the wrong time.
    Just because the Bayview/Hunter’s Point area has new condos and a new grocery store doesn’t mean that you should live there.
    These are the facts and if you think I am wrong, just walk into the Bayview Police Station on Williams St. and ask for a crime report. You will be astounded at the numbers and think twice before living there.
    I agree with Stephanie that it will take another 50 years to greatly improve this area. Just building condos will not help.

  8. Posted by bayview heights guy

    Response to Stan and other Bayview Haters: Yes, everyone in Bayview will agree that it is not Pacific Heights or St. Francis Woods. If you have that kind of money, go live there. I am hispanic, but it seems like most people on Socketsite have an unspoken aversion to Bayview (not Hunter’s Point-I agree that place is scary) because of the ethnicities that dominates here-African-Americans, Hispanics, and Asians. I have lived here forever and have experienced no burglaries, vandalism, theft, or other crime. Not once. On the contrary, my car was broken into on Cathedral Hill, next to Japantown, supposedly a safe part of SF. Bayview Heights, especially, is an undiscovered corner for most and we would like to keep it that way. We have trails by the water where we walk in the morning, easy access to the T-Third and freeway, etc. Don’t blame crime on people of certain ethnicities; blame it on bad people, because they come in all colors, shapes and sizes.

  9. Posted by Robert

    Response to Bayview Heights Guy,
    You claim to have not experienced any burglaries, vandalism, theft or other crime, etc. It sounds like you never get out of your apt. without getting into your vehicle and driving somewhere else.
    I don’t see you or your family walking or patronizing any restaurants or establishments anywhere along 3rd St. KFC & McDonald’s don’t count.
    Do you ride your bike or bring your friends and family and show them how beautiful 3rd St. is? Anywhere between Evans & Gilman? I don’t think so.
    No matter how many new condos and restaurants they build, 3rd St. will not change unless PEOPLE CHANGE as noted by Stephanie.
    Trails by the water? Which part of 3rd St. are you talking about?
    Be honest with yourself and the reason why you really live there. I know it’s not by choice.

  10. Posted by Bayview Heights Guy

    Response to Bayview Heights Guy,
    You claim to have not experienced any burglaries, vandalism, theft or other crime, etc. It sounds like you never get out of your apt. without getting into your vehicle and driving somewhere else.
    RESPONSE: I have a house, not apt., a very nice restored house with no burglar bars. READ THE POST BEFORE YOU REPLY.
    I don’t see you or your family walking or patronizing any restaurants or establishments anywhere along 3rd St. KFC & McDonald’s don’t count.
    RESPONSE: Uh, yes, I do. Unless you are following me, you wouldn’t know.
    Do you ride your bike or bring your friends and family and show them how beautiful 3rd St. is? Anywhere between Evans & Gilman? I don’t think so.
    RESPONSE: Dude, I live in the Heights and I was referring to my part of the neighborhood.
    No matter how many new condos and restaurants they build, 3rd St. will not change unless PEOPLE CHANGE as noted by Stephanie.
    Trails by the water? Which part of 3rd St. are you talking about?
    RESPONSE: Yes, there are trails by the water by Candlestick and there are a lot of us that walk there in the mornings.
    Be honest with yourself and the reason why you really live there. I know it’s not by choice.
    DUDE, CHILL OUT…IT’S JUST A DISCUSSION FORUM….AND YOUR RESPONSES JUST PROVED THE POINT I STATED BEFORE…RACIAL PROFILING.

  11. Posted by Jeff

    To Bayview Heights Guy,
    After reading this blog, I don’t see any hint of racial profiling from any of the comments. It is not fair to blame anyone of something they did not write.
    However, it’s getting heated for no reason, so peace to all.

  12. Posted by poor.ass.millionaire

    Bayview. 2014. How do you like me now?

  13. Posted by soccermom

    @PAM – I was thinking of your query over the weekend because I was recently in the same boat. I know the Bayview only in passing and wanted to learn my way around a little better.
    I signed up to tutor an elementary student with Reading Partners:
    http://info.readingpartners.org/volunteer-in-sf-east-bay
    once a week at Bret Harte elementary on Gilman in Bayview. It’s a great reason to drive over and I get a feel for the different streets on my way there and back. Bret Harte has a lot of need for volunteer help. Check it out!

  14. Posted by curmudgeon

    soccermom you’re the best

  15. Posted by Hitman

    I like to pop champagne and wiggle my toes on the mink rug at the club at 3rd and Newcomb.

  16. Posted by poor.ass.millionaire

    That’s commendable soccermom, as that school needs all the help it can get 🙂
    There are lots of nice streets with good buildings in Bayview, and you’re right, it varies block by block. I’d be curious to hear which streets/areas you like, and which you like less, as well as why. Always interesting to see some else’s POV.

  17. Posted by MissionGal

    Would love to hear more about BV. Was driving around there – my first time, I gotta admit. Neighborhood looks pretty normal to me, even saw 2 kids biking together in front of their house.
    However was wondering what have changed from 2007 to 2014?

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