With roughly 50% of the 75 condos in the South Court either closed or in contract, the 142-unit Homes on Esprit Park development (900 Minnesota) remains around 26% “sold” (25% in contract last May).
The North Court (Phase II) is expected to be online in about four months. And while we’ve seen little movement in terms of net-new sales over the past year, the new sales office staff (Polaris has replaced McGuire) reports a recent uptick in interest and activity.
No update on Esprit’s Urbino, the Nate Appleman/Shelley Lindgren restaurant (think A16 and SPQR) that’s been on hold since the beginning of the year.
Full Disclosure: Homes on Esprit Park currently advertises on SocketSite but did not provide any compensation for this post.
∙ 900 Minnesota: Now And Then [SocketSite 11/06]
∙ Homes On Esprit Park (900 Minnesota) Sales Update: 25% In Contract [SocketSite 5/08]
∙ ‘Hold that order,’ restaurants say [San Francisco Business Times]
I’m sure the construction lender on this one is thrilled with that sales rate.
Its possible the rate of sales could be improved by lowering prices. I wonder if the developer has considered this.
In a way it seems this development may be too nice for the real market. If smaller, cramped units with less light had been built and priced lower then they might sell better.
These are really expensive considering the size and location. I looked at them awhile back… nice finishes but tiny places for half a mil, located kind of in the middle of nowhere. Good luck.
I toured this the other day. The units are very expensive for what you get. Everything inside from the carpet to wood to construction feels cheep. $550 K for a small one bedroom. Plus HOA dues about $450 a month. Plus there is nothing within walking distance to the location. Worth about 250 to 300 K for a unit but I guess that only gets you a house in the bayview.
I’m calling bullsh*t on this number. And while I’m at it, I’m calling out BS on BLU too.
[Editor’s Note: Please do, but then back it up (preferably with analysis or at least an anecdote or two).]
There is quite a bit of shopping and dining, a fairly short walk up 18th or 20th.
This is a transitional area; UCSF is purchasing more of the large commercial parcels around Esprit Park. This area is definitely getting better.
I feel the finishes and plans are generally better than those in most new developments.
Prices seem high, but this is the case in most new SF developments.
I like the area, and think this development is not bad. However, I feel it’s overpriced. I have recently seen the 1br 1.5 ba apartments listed on craigslist for $2200. Anyone with a modicum of common sense and a rent/buy calculator would know that if you had a burning desire to live in this development that would be a better deal than a $550K price + HOAs + taxes and insurance.
Hey
Construction quality and cost at Esprit is very expensive, very expensive windows, radiant floor heat and lots of outdoor public space. The cost of these specs make sense for someones home not for 150 condo project, so I disagree with the cheap aspect. Want cheap go out and look around at many other projects. Dog Patch is booming with food, new restaurants and for me a good drinker lots of places to drink.
Lets all just be happy.
Thanks
Axis Cafe and Serpentine are really close by. Two very cool places to eat…
Lets all just be happy.
I’ll be happy when these fall another 25-40% in price, and I bet potential purchasers of these units will be too.
Well, from someone who was in contract last May and broke contract in October let me say that I support the developer and the project and the hood but I’m happy to see that McGuire is no longer handling sales. They were useless the whole time. Didn’t know the disclosures, talked about “instant equity” in early 2008, refused to face reality as things continued to get worse and felt they had to lecture me about ethics when I broke contract. In fact, the agent who worked with me continued to say that the whole project would be finished and sold by early 2009. Any idiot could tell that was not the case.
Jason and Bla Bla – since when in SF is a 1bed condo at 835sf small? Overpriced at half a mil? Yes! That is clearer now than ever! But these are not small units.
And these units could be had a year ago at the prices they are advertising now. So LMRiM is right. But you could probably get them at 20% lower than current advertised prices right now. The 40% reduction will come later.
Boo, amen to that.
Tough environment down there. We have to praise the work done on this place. I hope they will make a profit in the end but these price points are tough to sell out there.
I have visited this development twice, hardhat tour and completed South Court tour. The South Court is very nice, the brick and timber units have a certain charm to them.
The North Court does not fit in there at all. The color and style is more apartment building than high end condo, which I am afraid is where it will end up.
Interesting, I just got an email today from the sales office. We looked at Esprit Park a while back, and liked it. The sales staff, not so much. And when we visited around Q1/Q2 of 2008, they were “guaranteeing” that the entire development would be done by September 2008, at the latest.
The units we saw were nice and had character – brick, exposed beams and a cool layout for young singles or couples.
But you’ve got to be kidding me on the price. What it boils down to, in my opinion, is that they are charging established neighborhood prices in an up-and-coming neighborhood. Like it or not, Dogpatch is still up-and-coming. And even places like the Arterra (which you can love or hate, but is at least in a convenient neighborhood) are slashing prices big time.
Even if I’m buying just to live in my unit and not for any investment purpose, I don’t want the value of my home staying flat for the next ten years while UCSF starts buying up property and building things.
Do I think it’ll be a great location/development in the (distant) future, yes. Would I buy at Esprit Park today? Definitely not.
We toured this complex along with pretty much every other new development in the area. It ended up in our top 3 because of its reasonable HOA and nice amenities, although we ended up at the arterra in mission bay instead. We live in the dogpatch currently and the area is great, lots of food and shopping on 18th st, some good selection on 22nd, and the 3rd street muni makes downtown and the embarcadero easily accessible, the caltrain stop is also an added plus for those who commute down to the south bay.
The complex does have its drawbacks though. We didn’t like the “feels like we’re going through the back-way” feel of the hallways, nor the lack of privacy with all the condos facing each other. In the 1br/1.5 bath loft style condos, the developers conveniently forgot to place ANY storage in the bedroom and although they said they would credit about $15K for california closets to put some in, there’s no space except under the stairs…and really who wants that? It’s a shame since I love the exposed brick.
Frisee – you said you ended up at Arterra….what did you like better about Arterra? Or why did you choose that new development over the others? I’m looking at new developments and would be curious to hear opinions.
Karl,
We chose Arterra because it was a great combination of price, HOA (there’s a roofdeck, concierge and gym for about $430 for a 2br/1bath), location to transport (caltrain was essential and it’s a block to the muni), location to amenities (we can walk to safeway, wholefoods, food, bars etc.). Not to mention that we have a killer view of downtown and 10ft ceilings. The finishes were nice and the building is laid out well. Plus, we really like the development plans for mission bay and are really happy with the park that is already there.
The other places I can remember:
Blu – no view, high HOA ($700) for no amenities (less units in the building but it just didn’t seem to work out), wasn’t crazy about the area, the apartments felt a lot smaller than Arterra because they’re darker while Arterra gets a lot of natural light, no views and slightly further away from caltrain and amenities, weird valet system
Soma Grand – too fluffy, too many amenities (maid service, private yoga instructors etc.) although the price wasn’t bad, don’t like the neighborhood, far from caltrain, weird parking system
The hayes – love the neighborhood but the price was a little higher for a 2br than we would have liked and it was a little too far from our transportation options, it’s very similar to arterra and was one of our top 3
they severly overpriced these units. very simple. Lower the prices and they will sell.
the prices on these units has dropped – Ive seen them in the mls at what looks like a significant discount – I think they run about 550 a sq ft – which seems to me to be a pretty good deal for San Fran?
sfgirl – I don’t agree that $550 a square/foot is a good deal for Esprit Park.
I visited Esprit Park about a year ago, and I do have to say that their finishings are very nice. For the most part, I think the developers did a great job with the construction. However, the dogpatch is still an area that is being developed and with the recession a lot of things that were in the plans that would have made this area more appealing, have gotten pushed back(e.g. A-16 restaurant). At $550 a square foot, I think it will take a while to get a nice appreciation on your home. Personally, I think we are getting closer to the bottom as far as pricing is concerned, but many other posters on this board would probably argue that prices are going to continue to drop significantly. Wait another 6 months, and I think you’ll get some better pricing.
Wait another 6 months, and I think you’ll get some better pricing.
And if you can wait 6 more months then pricing will be even better! This bubble will take some time to burst in this quite wealthy city. We’re not in Modesto where there was no strong enough economy to cushion the fall or outdated local laws creating artificial scarcity. But a bubble is a bubble and ultimately behaves as such…
Redfin shows a few units priced from $542 psf to $700 psf.
http://www.redfin.com/search#lat=37.7593885&long=-122.3903704&market=sanfrancisco&sf=1,2&status=1&v=4&zoomLevel=18
Maybe Boo or someone else who bought or looked here can comment on how pricing has changed.
When I got in contract the 1/1.5’s were priced just under $620k on MLS which was a reduction from the original release price. I was in contract for basically where the same units are listed on MLS now. It was a “limited time only” sale according to sales office. Which of course would provide me that “instant equity”.
I knew that was crap back then, and I had drank some of the koolaid myself and figured with my income and 5 year hold I’d be cool. Well, September changed all that. Boom!
I seem to remember the 2/2’s with brick and timber in the South Court were close to $900k. Now on MLS those are in the mid $600’s I think. And the large 1bed loft style brick and timber in the South Court was available at $780k a year ago. The current MLS listings have mixed up unit #’s so I don’t know if what I’m seeing is accurate. Their MLS listings have always been sloppy. As if the economy wasn’t enough of an obstacle, McGuire decided they’d screw up the MLS listings as well.
I just put an offer on the 1/1.5 for 500K (MLS listed for 558K or so) last night. I actually really like the building. Wishing I could afford the brick and timber loft. But now I’m thinking I should of offered lower (like 450K). I see the point about how it is overpriced for the Dogpatch no matter how nice the building is. Oh well, if they counteroffer, I will decline and come back in 6 months.
Sorry to rain on the Arterra parade here, but I have toured it three times and let’s catalogue some of the drawbacks:
1. Constant loud humming train noise from the Caltrains idling all hours of the day and night in the yard. It was somewhat bearable with the windows tightly closed, but with the windows open, disastrous. Frisee, if you have 10-foot ceilings, it means you are on one of the top floors perhaps with a north-facing balcony – isn’t the balcony unusable due to the train noise/fumes?
2. No partking whatsoever for guests on Berry Street. Basically 1,000’s of housing units on Berry Street collectively share probably about 50 street parking spaces. If you have a party, where will people park? At the Beacon for $20 then walk over?
Anyway the sales people there are nice, but couldn’t get beyond these hindrances.
I have heard the Wells Fargo pulled out as the preferred lender in early may, along with the other construction stage financer. Good luck getting a loan there now.
We are on the 9th floor but do not have a balcony. Also, the noise isn’t that bad maybe because of the floor we’re on, especially with the windows closed. The building has a great ventilation system that allows fresh air to flow through the building without opening the windows.
the parking is a bit of a downer, but it’s not permanent. As the development progresses more parking will open up.
i looked hard at the 2/2 brick and timber units. suffice it to say that despite negotiating a fair bit off the “list” price of over 900k last year, the market and general economic degradation changed a lot of things.
they are really, really nice units–some of the best new construction in the city. and i think dogpatch is kind of fun. if those units really can be had for $450-500/sq ft (say $600k), that would/shoud be tempting.
My offer for the 1 bed/1.5 bath of 500K was countered for 525K from which I walked. I now believe I shouldn’t have even offered 500 for it. They are having a really hard time selling there hence the change from McGuire to Polaris. Even thought they changed the sales team, the listing prices appear to be the same as 4 months ago when I last looked. Definitely would snatch up one of those nice brick/timber lofts for 600K. They were asking 675-702K for them as of 2 days ago when I toured. And Wells is still the preferred lender there.
nick, just looking around on the mls, my sense is that the 1/1.5 should be at 450-475K currently and another 50K lower in 6 months. Good thing they didn’t take you up on your offer 🙂
Would anybody here happen to know what types of offers Esprit Park is accepting these days for a 1/1.5? My feeling is that 558K is too expensive. Even more so since the prices of existing homes in the neighborhood seemed to have dropped since this was published.
I’d just love to know what people have paid over the last couple of months.
Do you fear rejection? Start low and then wait for the market to come to you …
@dogpatchlover – I recently made an offer on what sounds like a similar unit at Esprit. It was solid, however below their MLS listing price. The sales office insisted that the unit is actually was $50 grand more than what they had on the MLS for that unit. They countered at $9 grand above their listing price! Now the unit has been withdrawn. Shady.
After looking for weeks, I came back to Esprit for the killer kitchen, and the idea of getting something brand-spanking new. I was really getting excited about the Dogpatch neighborhood, community, and location. Now back to square 1.