From another plugged-in tipster: “One Rincon Hill just sold one of the 2 penthouses available. This one on the 59th floor (Twin Peaks view, I believe) [floor plan below]. They don’t want to reveal the price, but let’s just say it went for substantially more than when it was reserved in June 2006. Home on the 55th floor (with sweeping balcony) is still available. Construction crane is down.”
∙ One Rincon Hill: An Official Update And A Few Confirmed Facts [SocketSite]
I’m sure i will get flamed, but I really think this is a beautiful building. i like it better than anything in the existing skyline, although i do like the design of the pelli clarke TB building
No flame from me, I love the building too! The crown really turned out well.
As for TB, I would rather have SOM’s version.
I like the fact it’s tall and slender. The existing height limits have produced far too many squat, bulky, shortish buildings downtown. I can only hope that One Rincon is literally the “shape” of things to come.
I like it much more from the the East view
Not so fond of it from the West
Also, I recall hearing that the second tower will be reversed 180 degrees so I might get the view I like after all of at least one towers
Is this correct?
The “flamers” (in reference to the above) must be taking an afternoon nap. I’m surprised they didn’t jump out of the woodwork on this one.
I agree, I was driving into the city on 280 and you see it from afar and it’s pretty spectacular looking. I only see it getting more attractive once some symmetry is created by the second tower, the Millennium, the second Infinity Tower, Turnberry and then the Californian.
“Is this correct?”
Yes, that is correct. You’ll get a 180 degree flip on the shorter second tower.
I didn’t hear or read anything about how the building reacted to the quake the other night…I know nobody lives there but any workers working/was the water tank full yet? Anybody have any news?
Well, I live in a smaller highrise nearby and the quake resulted in some gentle swaying. No loud sounds, cracks, or quick movements.
That notch in the crown is kind of a weird touch. I wonder if the building would look better without it.
As somebody pointed out, this think looks just like a giant Sharper Image air purifier. But maybe it will at least filter out the filthy urine and feces stench that pervades every neighborhood in SF except the Marina and Pac. Heights.
The building by itself might be OK design but it looks so obnoxiously out of place with it’s height and location. I’m surprised that South Beach didn’t go towards more of a Vancouver aesthetic.
“The building by itself might be OK design but it looks so obnoxiously out of place with it’s height and location. I’m surprised that South Beach didn’t go towards more of a Vancouver aesthetic.”
It won’t be out of place when all the other approved towers get built around it.
“Sharper Image air purifier”
So true! Never thought of it until you mentioned it but it does look like it.
Here it is, the world’s largest Ionic Breeze purifier:
http://sf.curbed.com/archives/2007/07/23/breezy.php
I’m guessing they designed it this way so they can turn it on and suck up all the smog and pollution from the traffic. I wonder if it’ll swivel 😉
was it a bad dream? i was napping and i had this dream that someone said they liked One Rincon…I actually didn’t hate the building earlier on when everyone else did, but as it’s finished, i just think it’s damned depressing and totally lacking in style or character. I hate the fact that i have to look at it from almost every vantage point in the center city. It’s worse than the Ionic Breeze, it serves no healthy purpose AND it’s ugly.
Ionic Breeze! You hit it on the head. Seriousely, these units will have crazy, insane views. And yes Adam, I will invite you to the house warming.
LMAO!!!!
that is so sweet
one ionic breeze hill
i love it!!!
that will be some incredible view from up there and the design of the balcony will actually make it useable. I’m also very happy to see that the pole is on the outside, a peeve I’ve had with so many highrises. Although the other units still have the pole. Watermark is the worse offender in my opinion.
I live nearby, and refer to it as “The Big Banal”. Still, the absence of the crane does improve it.
For my information, how can the penthouse go for “substantially more than when it was reserved in June 2006”? Did it fall out of contract?
[Editor’s Note: That it did. And for details, simply follow the links (they’re not for us, they’re for you).]
Paul Hwang and others associated with ORH…
I toured the model this weekend, and there is (in my opinion) a HUGE design flaw in the kitchen.
In BOTH models they left no room between the cabinet and the the wall on one side (in one of the models I’m pretty sure it’s the top cabinet far left.. I forget if it’s far left or far right on the other model).
Thus, due to the very large door handle, the upper cabinet is not able to be fully opened. Even worse, the handle gouges into the wood that covers where the fridge goes. It looks terrible, there is already a huge gash in the wood due to that handle and not enough spacer…
it is easily fixed… if they switch the way the first cabinet opens then the door will swing the other way, and not hit the side wall…
go look at it… it’s really terrible and needs to be fixed before they put all the kitchens in the units.
I’m surprised they left it like that in the model…
anyway, Paul you can do some huge good for your clients in fixing this asap…
as an aside, some friends and I celebrated the removal of the crane… it’s a big step.
they still don’t know when they’re moving in. every month they hear something different. Currently, scheduled to move in later May early June (above 45th floor)
I still personally hate the view of the building from this angle (in the pic) and I think the crown is TOO white and blocky… but I like the building from the other sides where the white isn’t so dominant.
and I have to admit, I like the glass they chose for ORH far better than that green plastic-looking glass for Infinity. (I like the shape of Infinity better though)
The picture posted looks like Anycity U.S.A. What is it about this side of town that seems so much like what I moved to escape from? Still, I do like the tower better now that the crown of the building is finished. I didn’t know this was to be a design to play off the art-deco Pacific Sailors Union building? If that is the case, I wish they had taken that idea a bit further and tried show that reference more clearly. It would have fit in better with the context of the bay Bridge as well.
A flaw with the kitchen cabinets is no problem as they should be redone between meals anyway.
I’m not sure how a two bedroom apartment gets classified as a penthouse….
Thanks for the suggestion ex-SFer, I did notice that oversight. Although I probably have very little pull with ORH regarding the construction of the building, I will be taking care of this problem for all my clients even if I have to do it myself.
Really I think the cabinets are a small issue; I just feel lucky that I was able to get so many of my incredible clients into the building on the first day of sales at amazing prices and terms.
Yes ORH may not be in the best location, or have the most unique exterior, or have the latest gadgets and finishes. However I think a lot of times the comments regarding ORH loose sight of what ORH is really all about:
1) 55 stories on top of a hill. You cannot avoid this building when you come into the city. It has an identity, people will recognize this building for years to come.
2) Basically all units will have views, and those that face east have a very, very low probability of ever having their wide open water views being blocked. I guarantee you no one will be looking at the cabinets when they walk into some of the nicer view units.
3) The units are / were reasonably priced with great terms (Day One: $1000 / ft on the 50th floor facing the Bay Bridge. And my Buyers only had to place a 3% deposit. >>> Are you kidding me ?!?!?!?!)
4)The Manhattenization of Rincon Hill into a Quintessential Urban / Pedestrian Lifestyle neighborhood. I was at Ozuma tonight and my friend commented how Steuart street reminded him of New York. There were people all over the place with valets double parking cars up and down the street. Ozuma was so packed we decided to leave and have a drink on the patio of the Cosmopolitan cafe. We talked about when “Chalkers” used to be in Rincon Center and how dead it was here at night. I remember those days vividly because I worked at 211 Main in the dot com days and would head over to meet my friends at Chalkers or Elroys (the one place in South Beach that was packed) after work. Once the new buildings become occupied and eventually after the new Transbay Terminal is built I can only see the neighborhood become more and more dense with retail.
Sorry about the long post, but I have been thinking about putting something like this up for a while.
Paul:
I agree that there could be incredible change in the Rincon Hill neighborhood. To me, the big “if” is still whether or not the other buildings get built… and if so, when. I’ve seen neighborhoods start to build up… and then stall out… that’s my one concern. I’d hate to live there as is with just one or two more towers nearby…
However, we had dinner on 3rd and Folsom, and the change there is remarkable when you consider what it was 10 years ago.
Thus it takes a long term view. I myself am not willing to pay premium prices for a neighborhood that will take 5-10 years to form… but others are and may be rewarded handsomely for it.
ORH is a building that will inspire love and hate, and for a few people like me it will inspire both. I thought the interior was much better than many comparable unnamed projects of similar price. That said, there are a few things I am not so fond of (the cabinet situation is a small thing, I also dislike the flooring options given for the price, and I hate the thick white candystripe side of the building as example).
but I’m glad SF is doing something about housing… and why not try a Vancouverized Rincon Hill? It opens up housing in the city while leaving the historic neighborhoods historic.
And in 10 years we may have another neighborhood to explore and enjoy! people will forget what Rincon Hill used to be. (just like most people forget that Noe Valley used to be working class, Potrero Hill working poor, SoMa just a bunch of warehouses, etc)
Buildings this big will never be about “fitting in”, but they can certainly have more of an idea behind their form, be done with more skill, or be more forward thinking and looking. One Rincon has LESS of all of the the above than any building I can think of built recently on a site this prominent, in a a city this well known.
I find it quite sad that people are capitulating to this generic crap as being alright. Why shouldn’t it have been a work of great architecture at this scale, in this place? Rather than this formulaic auto-pilot design — this Richard Meier lite, (on steroids, to boot)!
I like this building a lot. Coit Tower, Golden Gate Bridge, and Transamerica were all hated by some and protested by others, but now they are uniquely San Francisco. Like it or not, ORH is the new SF landmark.
“I’m not sure how a two bedroom apartment gets classified as a penthouse….”
One Rincon may be huge, but the units are small and are geared toward the rental crowd. They have Jr 1 bedrooms, small 2 bedrooms, and Jr penthouses. Easy to rent, but not the optimal size or layout for primary residential living.
Millenium and Infinity has REAL penthouses!
Paul H, I don’t think Steuart street and Rincon Center is in Rincon Hill. It’s more of the Embarcadero and will primarily benefit Infinity and Millenium residents. One Rincon residents will have to drive anywhere for entertainment/amenities. For the near term, Rincon Hill is a drive in/drive out neighborhood. Maybe in 10 years it’ll change, but it’s still a neighborhood in transition.
“One Rincon residents will have to drive anywhere for entertainment/amenities. For the near term, Rincon Hill is a drive in/drive out neighborhood.”
Perhaps you are just lazy. I walked around the neighborhood last weekend and you can literally walk from the Infinity to ORH in less than 5 minutes. I ate at Yank Sing walked to ORH, back to the Ferry Building to get some groceries and then back to my car on Harrison. It was a beautiful day and the walk was very pleasant and not too long at all.
They are opening two new restaurants right down the street, etc. I think it is a stretch to say Rincon Hill is a drive in/drive out neighborhood especially compared to a lot of other SF neighborhoods.
“I find it quite sad that people are capitulating to this generic crap as being alright. Why shouldn’t it have been a work of great architecture at this scale, in this place? Rather than this formulaic auto-pilot design — this Richard Meier lite, (on steroids, to boot)!”
Great architecture is in the eye of the beholder. People hated transamerica when it was first built. Many people I have spoken to have already changed their opinion about ORH since its crown was finished. Just wait until all the other towers are complete and the zoning plan becomes more clear.
Rincon Hill is a drive-in/drive-out neighborhood. If it wasn’t, then where is all the pedestrian traffic? Go there on any sunny afternoon, the place is quite desolate, except for all the vehicular traffic.
Unfortunately, there’s just not a lot of nice places to walk around up there. I can’t imagine leaving ORH to take a short, leisurely stroll down 1st St. or Fremont St from Harrison. If you look at the boundaries of Rincon Hill, there’s no place of interest to walk.
Once they develop Folsom Blvd. and widen Main, Beale, etc, the neighborhood will be nice, but that’s 5-10 years away…
http://www.sfgov.org/site/uploadedfiles/planning/Codes/Rincon_Map9.pdf
The 2 new restaurants at Embarcadero, Steuart St, and Rincon Center, Ferry building, waterfront, etc. Those are all great and wonderful places to walk to for all the new Infinity and Millenium residents. I can’t wait! 🙂
When I used to live at Museum Parc (3rd at Folsom), my wife and I would walk to the old Farmers Market in the parking lot close to Golden Gateway Commons, up the steps on Sansome to Coit tower, down to North Beach and back home to Museum Parc. They great thing about the city, is that it as an awesome place to explore on foot.
If getting from 1st and Harrison down to the Embarcadero requires you to use a car, you need to re-examine if San Francisco is the right city for you. It will take you longer to find a parking space near Ozuma on a Friday night , then to walk the 3 blocks.
If you work in the financial district, I guarantee you walk 10 times farther every single day.
“Paul H, I don’t think Steuart street and Rincon Center is in Rincon Hill. ”
Hmmm, “Rincon Center is not in Rincon Hill”, hmmmmm. I guess the “Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim” are not in LA. However:
http://www.rinconhillneighbors.org/
“The 2 new restaurants at Embarcadero, Steuart St, and Rincon Center, Ferry building, waterfront, etc. Those are all great and wonderful places to walk to for all the new Infinity and Millenium residents. I can’t wait! :-)”
Do all of your posts begin with a ORH stab and end with how the Infinity and Millenium are so great?
Frankly, I’d rather walk from ORH to the Embarcadero than out of the Millenium.
anon, yes they do! 😉
Paul, on the SF Gov site, Rincon Center IS NOT in Rincon Hill:
http://www.sfgov.org/site/uploadedfiles/planning/Codes/Rincon_Map9.pdf
But I guess the all powerful Rincon Hill *Association* takes precedence, huh?
“Great architecture is in the eye of the beholder. People hated transamerica when it was first built…Just wait until all the other towers are complete and the zoning plan becomes more clear.”
Great architecture is not simply in the eye of the beholder, it is in the books by architectural historians and theorists — and I guarantee this building will never be. To compare Transamerica to ORH is laughable! The ‘Pyramid’ is a formal and structural tour de force. This is a generic curtain wall tower. And if ORH takes other buildings to be built around it (to draw one’s attention away from it) to be prove its value, that’s basically an admission of it’s mediocrity.
Rincon Hill is the area between The Embarcadero, 2nd Street, Mission Street, and Bryant. Toss your link to the planning crap in garbage because it is irrelevant to where the cluster or residential is going to be surrounding Folsom Boulevard, and that area is Rincon Hill just as it was in 1852 when all the rich folks of the time lived in Rincon Hill.
Just curious. Why is it so important to some what is or is not part of Rincon Hill? I guess I am at a loss to understand all this debate as the “neighborhood” is a long way from being finished. It seems like some are trying to seize other more desirable locations and claim they are now in “Rincon Hill”. (The Ferry Building is now in Rincon Hill!?)
I think the Lake Shore East model in Chicago is a better example. A virtual no-mans-land that has been turned into quite a desirable spot in the last 12 years. As the whole area is almost complete, believe me, those people no longer have any desire to call buildings 8 blocks away part of Lake Shore East now that it is a very exclusive address. lakeshoreeast.com is an interesting read for what Rincon Hill might be in 15 years.
You’re comparing Rincon Hill with Lake Shore East in Chicago? Not even a comparison.
I lived in SOMA for several years and now live in Chicago.
Lake Shore East was developed out of an old golf course. They’re putting in a dozen high rises and some townhouses. As you can see from the link that was provided, there is a big park in the middle of the development (that is quite nice, actually.)
It’s a suburban development built for suburbanites (which are the majority of the buyers so far.) It is far from the major shopping/restaurant districts. You have to drive everywhere.
So far, they have put in a couple of coffee shops in the ground floor of the already completed high rises. A supermarket is supposed to go on one corner of the park. Not sure about any other restaurants.
For Chicagoans who don’t live in Lake Shore East, there is no reason to go there- so there is no “neighborhood” there.
Rincon Hill is completely different. There are already restaurants and entertainment close by. They are trying to build a true “urban” neighborhood- not simply a bunch of high rises surrounding a park.
Lake Shore East is hoping that the $2 million plus townhouses they are building around part of the base of the park will give it a more “neighborhoody” feel. But it’s my experience that you can’t build a neighborhood from scratch in 10 years and expect it to be North Beach or the Inner Sunset or, in Chicago, Wicker Park or Lakeview. Some of it has to develop organically. (Although some might argue that Santana Row is a “success” at neighborhood building.)
“Just curious. Why is it so important to some what is or is not part of Rincon Hill? I guess I am at a loss to understand all this debate as the “neighborhood” is a long way from being finished. It seems like some are trying to seize other more desirable locations and claim they are now in “Rincon Hill”. (The Ferry Building is now in Rincon Hill!?)”
Maybe it’s because Infinity and Millenium people don’t want to be associated with One Rincon Hill? Seems the building has bad karma and negativity
And my 2 cents worth. I think the SFgov map is accurate. How can Rincon Center, Infinity, Millenium be on Rincon HILL?? It’s not even close to being on the HILL.
Call it whatever you want, that’s not the point. Anyone who says 1st and Harrison is too far to walk to the Embarcadero never walked it before.
I’m looking at Rincon Hill as the continuous existing and planned residential area east of 2nd Street, north of Bryant, and south of Mission. My goal is to have a neighborhood voice in City Hall via an eventual neighborhood association. Right now, Rincon Hill has no voice in City Hall as a disparate collection of individuals (though I admit folks who work for the City have been fairly responsive to me and welcoming of my efforts to get a neighborhood association off the ground).
The area between Mission, Bryant, 2nd, and The Embarcadero is undergoing the high-rise condo development over the next 10-15 years … sure, the planning department has split it up into “Transbay” and “Rincon Hill” for obvious reasons – Transbay is mostly government owned property (City or State) that will be developed. Rincon Hill already has several condo buildings and other buildings that area already privately owned.
That’s my motivation … to form one and only one neighborhood identity … Rincon Hill .. to help with getting a neighborhood association off the ground and having a voice in City Hall. It is because Rincon Hill residents residents didn’t have a proper say in City Hall in the 1800’s that Rincon Hill looks more like a bump in San Francisco’s terrain instead of the 100+ foot hill is used to be prior to the dirt filling in the crescent coast that came into what is now First Street (yes, a good chunk of us working in high-rise buildings in the FiDi are sitting on top of landfill).
If we have conflicting neighborhood names/identities, that is an impediment, from my point of view, to make people feel “associated.”
To go on a bit, South Park was considered park of Rincon Hill when it was developed in 1855. I recommend the book “Rincon Hil and South Park” by Albert Shumate if you’re curiosity is piqued about what San Francisco’s original coastline looked like before they cut through Rincon Hill to level out a path down 2nd Street, before dirt was taken off of Rincon Hill to fill in what we now call the Financial district and Mission Bay, and Rincon Hill was further degraded for the construction of the Bay Bridge.
If you want to help form a neighborhood association for Rincon Hill, let me know … rinconhill@gmail.com http://www.RinconHillSF.org
“On” Rincon Hill is different from “In” the neighborhood called Rincon Hill.
“It’s a suburban development built for suburbanites (which are the majority of the buyers so far.) It is far from the major shopping/restaurant districts. You have to drive everywhere.”
Sabrina, you make my point. What you wrote could be as easily for One Rincon as it could for Lake Shore East. Lake Shore East is only 5 blocks to Michigan Ave. and much more in the “heart” of Chicago than 1RinconHill, yet it is a new “neighborhood” of towers without almost any typical neighborhood stores or restaurants and feels dead. I see Rincon Hill as being more of a suburbran dev. also (with many second homeowners) in that you are still far from the areas most of us would want to shop and dine in. I will predict that the primary way people will enter and exit One Rincon is in their cars. It will never have a “neighborhoody” feel as you mentioned. (Neither does Lake Shore East)
Jamie, I don’t agree with everything that you say but I commend you on your efforts to work toward a Rincon Hill Neighborhood Association.
Sorry for the rant but you’ve hit a nerve.
What is the quintessential SF neighborhood? A block with small businesses surrounded by large amounts of housing within walking distance that generates a large amount of foot traffic night and day.
The castro, west portal, new chinatown on clement, alta plaza, japantown, 7th and irving, cole valley, noe valley, north beach, the haight, the marina, the mission, etc.
All of this was figured out by Jane Jacobs and published in her seminal book “The death and life of great american cities” … 50 YEARS AGO. And we still can’t get it right. I point to my irritant du jour, Berry Street.
Here you’ve got a new development that is nothing but rows of giant commuter storage pods. There is no infrastructure at street level to allow the development of a thriving small business district. Because of the choices developers made and the city acquiesced to that block will be a deserted sterile concrete wasteland forever. It could have been a true neighborhood if the damn planning department had actually done it’s job, but that would have cut into the developer’s profits.
Sigh.
End rant.
I’m all for neighborhood associations, but please keep the Rincon name off of the Infinity. I consider that the Embarcadero, not on a hill called Rincon and bought at the Infinity because of the waterfront proximity as well as other reasons, parking being one of them.
“I’m all for neighborhood associations, but please keep the Rincon name off of the Infinity.”
That’s one of the stupidest comments I have seen yet on Socketsite! Yeah!
Rincon Hill has The Met towers, Bridgeview, Baycrest etc, and it was never a neighborhood that had any pedestrian traffic. Why? Because most people leave the buildings via the garage, not the front door. One Rincon will be the same. The area won’t be conducive to walking unless:
1. We get rid of the traffic and onramp (not going to happen).
2. We figure out a way to attract small retailers and eateries to line the streets (impossible with the current infrastructure).
Jamie, I’d like to see your association and commend your efforts. But isn’t it difficult when many of the condos are either second homes or rentals? I know The Met is around 40-50 percent occuppied at any given time.
It doesn’t matter to the neighborhood if the residents are owners or renters as long as there are people there. The real problem is that these were purchased as investments and are mostly unoccupied.
I drive past the beacon all the time around 7pm and I swear I’ve never seen more than 10% of the units lighted at any time.
I am another Infinity buyer and I agree we should have a separate area called Embarcadero or Waterfront for places like Hills Plaza, Infinity, Gap building, Ferry building, etc. That area shouldn’t be a part of Rincon hill since its a waterfront neighborhood and not on the hill. And frankly, I rather not be mention as being near One Rincon. Negativity follows that building for whatever reason.
Well, perhaps Infinity buyers would like to put in some time establishing an “Embarcadero/Waterfront” neighborhood association … I’ll join that one too in addition to working with folks to set up a Rincon Hill association that is inclusive of the area I’d like folks to identify as the Rincon Hill neighborhood (again, Mission to Bryant and 2nd to The Embarcadero) – not “On” Rincon Hill, but “In” a neighborhood that I can only best identify as Rincon Hill for the residential piece since that’s what it was called years ago … and if you look at the San Francisco maps along The Embarcadero on the signs and on the free toilets, Rincon Hill is pretty well notated as the area I’m describing.
I don’t see how The INfinity’s City Hall issues are much different from One Rincon Hill … and splintering into different groups deteriorate’s our leverage in City Hall.
1) When the Big One (earthquake) hits, there are similar issues for folks living in the high rises above the 7th floor. We are going to need each other to mitigate the disaster. Wouldn’t it be nice to know each other beforehand instead of living as strangers in our vertical gated communities (high-rise condo buildings)? By the way, if you’re moving into Rincon Hill, please sign up and take the fire department’s NERT training http://www.sfgov.org/sfnert
2) As pedestrians in Rincon Hill, we all need to put pressure on the MTA to figure out how to slow cars down during non-business hours so that our crosswalks are relatively safe. This is the topic that made me start my blog and the impetus to eventually create a neighborhood association.
3) We’re served by the same MUNI lines more or less. The N, K-T, 12 bus, and through the week a 1 and 41 (or whatever that workday Union Street commuter line is) – and the Tranbay Terminal, which will be sitting kitty corner from The Infinity in about 2 years if things go according to plans.
4) Neighborhood amenities like widening the sidewalks, setting up a couple of humble parks, and getting the Rincon Hill Community Center at the Sailors Union of the Pacific building at 1st and Harrison benefit us all – but then again, maybe folks won’t walk 5 minutes from Folsom to Harrison and then up Harrison to the Community Center (from the Infinity)? Anyway – we need to pressure City Hall to get this stuff implemented now rather than later – otherwise it ends up like Pier 36 – an eyesore with no definite timeline for when it will be fixed up and complimentary to the neighborhood.
I could go on, but I’ve probably blabbed my views enough on SocketSite to make Adam cringe by now. 🙂
Anyway… I’d like to be a part of a neighborhood association … I don’t believe it benefits us to splinter off for more or less petulant reasons.
Neighborhood boundries have a REAL impact on the price of real estate, and I am not sure if you rent or own Jamie, but it is obvious some feel that being included in your “Rincon Hill” neighborhood is not to their financial advantage. For those of us who have lived here for decades, I have become censorious when I here someone lives in Pacific Heights or Noe Valley as these boundries have also grown over time by block after block. Expanding Rincon Hill to include more prestigious buildings and locations only confuses people and does not help to locate a property. BTW, after the Big One, high rise dwellers will not be in need as the real problems will be in the Marina, and in the thousands of unreinforced masonary structures throughout the city.
The article is incorrect. It’s not sold until it closes.
Cooper, normally when people put an offer and deposit down on a home, and that offer is accepted, people say “I bought a home.” I highly doubt people buying the penthouse are not going to be able to close this deal.
“Neighborhood boundries have a REAL impact on the price of real estate, and I am not sure if you rent or own Jamie, but it is obvious some feel that being included in your “Rincon Hill” neighborhood is not to their financial advantage.”
This is truly one of the most ridiculous directions any topic has taken on Socketsite. The Rincon Hill area was in existence before any of these buildings. To think that being associated with Rincon Hill is negative is just ignorant. Talk about Infinity egos! Should we also rename the Rincon Center to the Embarcadero/Waterfront Center? Oh no, Infinity is between two building named Rincon!
Egads, Four Seasons & the St. Regis are located in SoMa! Say it isn’t so. Better sell now, before everyone finds out.
“This is truly one of the most ridiculous directions any topic has taken on Socketsite.”
“That’s one of the stupidest comments I have seen yet on Socketsite! Yeah!”
Sorry if this comes off as harsh, but how can you even tell anymore?
Neither the Infinity, the Millennium, nor any other luxury high-rise discussed over the last year and half on this site has even come close to approximating the animosity that this project engenders among a select group of “vocal” posters to this site. And the level of ridiculity lately has leaped off the chart.
If you didn’t know better, you’d think that “One Rincon Hill” was the name of a living person that had actually done something directly to these people that was both personal and highly offensive. And I’m not talking about an articulate debate regarding whether the building is attractive or whether it’s in a good location vs. a bad location relative to other properties. All of that is completely reasonable for a discussion on this site.
I’m talking about some of the outrageous personal comments that, like I said, you would only expect to see directed toward an actual person that had done something to offend the person making the comment.
I mean, c’mon. It’s just so cheap and old at this point.
Jamie: “I don’t see how The INfinity’s City Hall issues are much different from One Rincon Hill … and splintering into different groups deteriorate’s our leverage in City Hall.”
IMHO, what’s most important to improving the value of those condos will be: (1) a badass neighborhood association that cajoles and cudgels what it needs from City Hall et al; and (2) a commitment to support your local retailers and shop & dine in your own neighborhood. And, in this context, the word “neighborhood” encompasses both Folsom & Main and First & Harrison. Those who live elsewhere can’t and won’t do it for you.
Regardless of the negative comments against ORH, did’nt this building have contracts/reservations or whatever you may call them, for all units pretty early on. I don’t think these neighborhood arguments really mattered to those individuals that put down their money way ahead of ever moving there. Granted, whether people will bail out is another question, but I just don’t see that happening enough to make everyone else buying there feel remorsefull of doing so. And it appears that some residents to be are stepping up to improve the area. Hope they succeed!
O.K. I’ll jump in also. Why can’t an Infinity buyer not have a say in what they feel their neighorhood should be called? This goes on all over the city. It is understandable if they would rather be called “Embarcadero” instead of Rincon Hill since I think Embarcadero gives a better idea of where they are going to live. I don’t see what is so “stupid” about people wanting to have a say in where they live. I would think Jamie would understand this?
“This is truly one of the most ridiculous directions any topic has taken on Socketsite.”
It may be ridiculous, but I do see their side as well.
Say I live on the edge of Nob Hill, bordering Tenderloins/Civic Center. As an owner with immense pride on my property, I’d rather know I’m located in Nob Hill and not Civic Center or Tenderloins, even if it’s only a couple blocks away.
So the question is, why would people in the Tenderloins care what neighborhood I want to be in? It’s pretty much the same with Infinity buyers. If they want to carve out their own Waterfront neighborhood, then more power to them. Why would Rincon or Soma people care so much about where Infinity residents call home, other than wanting to set a powerful neighborhood association?
I’m trying to hold back from continuing this thread much more … but I totally agree with the idea of supporting local businesses because there is a co-dependent relationship there. We love the conveniences of the businesses, and hope to have many more in Rincon Hill and surrounding areas (South Beach, SoMa, Yerba Buena, FiDi, whateva). The other point I very strongly agree with is that we’ll need to have neighborhood association(s) to get anything done at City Hall. This is a political town, and I’ve quickly learned that you need leverage (active electorate) to get anything done.
I’m totally cool with Infinity folks starting their own neighborhood thing … I own a block away at Baycrest, and maybe I’ll be included in that map… we share Main Street, eh? 🙂 I still believe the quality of life in the area revolves around Transbay and the Bay Bridge for Infinity, Millennium, and One Rincon Hill folks (not to mention those of us living in humble dwellings that were built in 1991 and a little later)
“Why can’t an Infinity buyer not have a say in what they feel their neighorhood should be called?”
It’s simple, because the area/neighborhood was there before the Infinity.
I’m tossing my hat in with Jamie’s assessment of the need for an association with meaningful impact at city hall. Sure it would be great to have an embarcadero neighborhood association but who’s it going to include? Hills Plaza and The Infinity. Let’s be realistic. We would be much better served focusing on what happens along Folsom to 2nd, Main St, etc, as a cohesive whole. The Embarcadero is pretty much set..not much more to influence.
Don’t get me wrong. I love the location of the Infinity and traded off better views to be steps to the waterfront. It is on the Embarcadero..and location, location, location. Great design, great amenities, quality construction. All things to be proud about.
However, I have to say I’m embarassed by the tonality of some of the other Infinity buyers. Say what you want of ORH – love it, hate it – but what we don’t need is snobery. Reminds me of new money, if you know what I mean.
“Say I live on the edge of Nob Hill, bordering Tenderloins/Civic Center. As an owner with immense pride on my property, I’d rather know I’m located in Nob Hill and not Civic Center or Tenderloins, even if it’s only a couple blocks away.”
That area has its own name, “The Tendernob”. Of course if you are an owner with immense pride you won’t call it that, but other people will. Every two-three block area in this city has to have its own name.
For a penthouse, it is really quite small. I could not even fit my ligne roset bed and nightstands into that master bedroom and still be able to comfortably walk around the bed. 13 by 13 is tiny for a master bedroom!
I am in contract at The Infinity and had the (mis) fortune to go up and see my unit. Views are great, neighborhood is great, exterior design is beautiful, but it is like a book with great cover art and a weak story line. I mean the hallway bathroom is Atlanta apartment quality (decided against local references).Master bath is OK, but seriously this place is more about form over function. It feels cheap and is a sad waste of beautiful exterior design. I am one bad day away from canceling my contract and chalking up the 3% to a lesson learned the hard way…the first pretty face you see may not be the right one. If the Infinity succeeds in holding its value it will be because of the location of the building, not because of the livability of the units.
By the way, watch out for the sales people at The Infinity, they have a tendency to be pretty vague about details that are important (storage units, terrace dividers, hall bath finishes).
If you own in this building, I suggest you get an appointment to get in and see your unit. They are taking people up now.
weatherman,
I’m surprised you are complaining about the quality of bathrooms instead of the color of cabinets. : ) The bathroom’s walnut cabinetry is exactly the same as the ones used at the Millennium if I remember correctly. The marble countertop was simply an elegant choice imho. And most people would probably consider honed limestone flooring to be much better than just “OK”. Everything in the second bathroom is the same as master bath except flooring. But how much could it cost to change the 2nd bath’s flooring if its marginal value is so high for you? The model home shows what will come with the actual units. It’s rather difficult to understand why you decided to pay over $1500 psf and now express this dramatic disappointment shortly after. Did it perhaps have anything to do with the fact that you knew other people had paid over $2000 psf? You sound like an honest and decent guy, but it’s almost as if you had to convince yourself and others that the Infinity was a terrible choice.
I’ve also toured pretty much the entire building. And I have to completely disagree with you about the spatial qualities of the interiors. I remember you mentioning that you bought above the 28th floor. Majority of the Infinity’s high floor units are sheltered by 1 to 2 huge terraces. Their functionality speaks for itself, but the way the terraces are designed to diverge from the skin creates this very compelling and unique view frame (check your photos again). The continuous bay of windows also performs as a visual ribbon that blends the different spatial experiences into one. If you are looking for the traditional potato rooms linked by straight forward circulations, obvious Infinity is not for you. Frankly, I think the architects did a brilliant job for the inside as outside, particularly in terms of highlighting the views.
I hope this doesn’t sound like I’m trying to tell you how you should feel about your purchase. But honestly I don’t think you understood what this project is about. If finishes is your most important consideration, you should probably look into Millennium and see if you can find a home you love. But to save you from another loss of 10% deposits when the next project with the “best” finishes comes out, I would remind you that finishes should be one of the last factors you need to worry about in terms of holding values. The difference between these new luxury condos’ finishes is small. And in the long run, money spent on finishes does not appreciate well as trends and technology quickly evolve. For example, St. Regis, being a newer building than Four Seasons, has much “better” finishes in comparison. But when it comes to resale, it has zero impact on prices. The demand for Four Seasons is in fact higher than St. Regis right now. In the end, it’s all about location and other things that cannot be easily replaced, such as outstanding architecture.
It takes most people a process to understand precisely how they feel about a purchase. If you feel you’ve reached that point, then just happily let it go. If you are considering the Millennium, you’d better hurry up. It’s only been a week, the project is already over 10% in contract. One of the two 10M penthouses is also sold. Prices have been increased by 5-6%. Since Millennium opened doors, the Infinity’s sales office has been flooded with new contracts. Believe it or not, if your unit goes back to the market, it will sell for higher within a few weeks. Whatever may still trouble you, remember lots of people would love to have your $1500 psf struggle. Good luck!
Jeez… Sorry about the long post.
blahhh –
As I have said in a couple of other posts, I think the Infinity is a beautiful building and I am not trying to piss on anyone’s excitement about living there. I bought there because of the design and location which are superior in my layman’s opinion to anything currently or proposed to be built in the neighborhood (I think I will stay out of the controvery on just what the neighborhood should be called!).
When I went up in the building though I was disappointed that the developer elected to “cheap out” on some of the finishes. As a factual point, there is no mock up in The Infinity showroom for the 2nd bathroom or the hallway powder room so there is no point of reference on those. They used hollow core doors for the bedroom closets, a prefab shower pan in the second bathroom, and the marble floor they had promised for the hall bath became tract home looking tile. I guess I didn’t expect these things and therein lies the problem for me: expectations that spending over $2 million for a condo would come with “appropriate” materials.
It is the juxtaposition of this beautiful and graceful building with some “substandard” finishes that disappoints me. They should have provided options for “upgrades” for those people who wanted them.
And thanks for putting me in my place about the $1500 sq foot struggle. It is a small issue in the grand scheme, but this is a real estate blog site and I reserve the right to whine on here if I want .
blahh, weatherman,
Are they allowing any buyers into the building? When did they start letting people go up?
Also weatherman, it shouldn’t be difficult to get Adriyl Designs or another contractor to upgrade the shower stall and flooring in the 2nd bath. And the doors can be replaced easily yourself.
After spending 2M, seems 10-20k for some upgrades is minimal and shouldn’t be a determining factor in purchasing your unit. It’s always better to purchase based on location and design first, not the finishes in the 2nd bath..
“They should have provided options for “upgrades” for those people who wanted them.”
On that I agree with you. For a high profile project like the Infinity it’s only reasonable to expect a great degree of freedom to customize. But it is not because Tishman Speyer is being “cheap” or unthoughtful. It really isn’t. The problem is rooted in how this giant company operates. There are simply too many levels of subcontracting. Even altering the smallest thing will end up costing buyers an arm. Could they have used better finishes in certain areas? Absolutely. But why not use fraction of that additional cost to customize by yourself?
It sounds like you pretty much made up your mind, but I guarantee you will have a completely different feeling about the development when it’s finished. For most people without architectural background it’s impossible to visualize the finished product while walking through building paper and raw cement. I could be wrong, but I feel your disappointment is more in the disparity between expectation and a premature reality rather than the product itself.
“Are they allowing any buyers into the building? When did they start letting people go up?”
They just started doing that. But if you bought at the Infinity, I strongly recommend you to delay that pleasure of your first visit!! There is nothing to see in the building right now. Wait till at least the lobby and some of the landscape are done. Trust me, it’ll make your future home much sweeter.
“I’m not sure how a two bedroom apartment gets classified as a penthouse….”
I think we all have this image of “penthouse” from old movies: the single apartment that covers the top floor, a separate elevator, a terrace, etc. But nowadays, it means something like “fancy unit near the top.” It’s a little more specific than “spacious” or “elegant,” which are used almost anywhere. That’s OK. I was under no delusions about it when I bought #5902, where “penthouse” means one of the units on the top 2 floors, which come with a certain class of upgrades. They could call 60 “Penthouse Major” and 59 “Penthouse Minor” for all I care. 🙂
It does have the “Twin Peaks view,” as you said, but that’s only part of it. Like many of the units on that corner of the building, from floor 29 on up, it has four of the six windows on the sunny side of the building and more windows around the corner, facing the bay. I was lucky enough to get a tour of the 60th floor, and the view is breathtaking.
The fact that this unit “fell out of contract” is not a sign of anything other than that people’s lives and decisions change, especially with long escrow times. While I have sympathy for the previous owner, I have to admit I’m glad it was available. Indeed, it was just dumb luck on my part that I happened to walk into the sales office shortly after the unit went back on the market. It’s not as if I had been tracking the available units or had put my name on some waiting list. As far as the price is concerned, I would have been surprised if it had NOT gone up in 15 months.
I know the neighborhood is not very fancy yet, but I’ll be there for the long haul, so I’m looking forward to watching it develop.
Enjoy your new home. We’ll be looking forward to getting the inside scoop as occupancy begins and the building starts filling up.
the brannan did the same thing, calling the top 2 floors the penthouse. both had higher ceilings and came with 2 parking spaces however.
It’s really sad that this thing got built. It is ugly and really detracts from the beautiful San Francisco skyline. It’s really sad that so many transplants have moved to San Francisco and brought their views of a city here without really knowing what San Francisco is all about. BIGGER IS NOT ALWAYS BETTER. I don’t want to live in a city that is full of skyscrapers like NYC or Chicago. I have lived and been coming to SF for all my life and always treasured it as a city of balance. I hope there are more true San Franciscans that will fight further buildings like this in our beautiful city and stop the development of skyscrapers being considered right now.
STOP THE MANHATTANIZATION OF SAN FRANCISCO!
It’s really fantastic that this thing got built. It is inspiring and really adds to the beautiful San Francisco skyline. It’s really great that so many transplants have moved to San Francisco and brought their views of a real city here while building upon what San Francisco was all about. SAN FRANCISCO NEEDS MORE HOUSING. I don’t want to live in a city that is full of ossified, myopic NIMBYs like Mill Valley or Colonial Williamsburg. I have lived and been coming to SF for all my life and always treasured it as a city of balance. I hope there are more true San Franciscans that will promote further buildings like this in our beautiful city and cheer for the development of skyscrapers being considered right now.
GROW UP SAN FRANCISCO!